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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 10:48 am
Lenny Leonard wrote:Look at those crowd figures.. People vote with their feet, not their remotes... Especially in Sydney


You're doing yourself a disservice by selecting from one table.

The crowd figures are actually irrelevant in determining TV revenues.
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 10:49 am
But it's a damn good indication of the quality of your product.. Which you are promoting to potential broadcasters
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 10:51 am
Lenny Leonard wrote:But it's a damn good indication of the quality of your product.. Which you are promoting to potential broadcasters


Actually, it's not. The broadcasters look at the TV ratings.
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 10:54 am
The people care SOOO little about the AFL, that their lowest crowd attendance average, the GC Suns is 18,000.
Which is good for what? 3rd or 4th place in the NRL

And nearly double that of the GC Titooons, their NRL counterpart

Interesting you posted those GE, given that this figure in particularly is DAMNING for the NRL v AFL debate... basically it's SOO and the Test match the rates out of it's ****, and the round games are dominated by AFL. So for 4 games a year, the NRL has huge viewership, and for the other 300 games a year, the numbers much the same, only AFL has viewers in all the majors for each game. Whilst the NRL does not.
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 11:01 am
greeneyed wrote:
Lenny Leonard wrote:But it's a damn good indication of the quality of your product.. Which you are promoting to potential broadcasters


Actually, it's not. The broadcasters look at the TV ratings.


Forgot you were a marketing guru.. Don't mind me
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 11:05 am
NRL Rep games kill it in the ratings.
However AFL and NRL round games basically are a wash in terms of ratings overall, much of the same... except the AFL have significant viewers in all the majors, the NRL does not.The AFL has teams all over the country, the NRL does not.
So the ratings are the same, except potential advertisers buy in AFL time slots get to advertise to people across the entire country, where as those buying spaces in NRL time slots, are advertising almost exclusively to NSW and QLD

I mean i dont think you need to have a business degree to figure out that most national companies like Harvey Norman or Woolworths, or Comm Bank (and that's who's advertising in these slots, it's not Uncy Steve's Metal Detector Emporium at Fyshwick) would rather pay for ads that are seen by 1 million people across the country, than they would to have 1 million see it across only 2 states.

So again, why are we shocked they are getting more for their rights than we are?

If we want more money for our rights, we'd better figure out a way to get Perth and Adalaide in our national competition.
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 11:08 am
Exactly.. It's not a straw man argument at all

Watch the Friday night pregame on fox footy.. The amount of sponsors they work into that is insane, purely because the sponsors target that program due to its reach
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Laurie Daley
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 11:43 am
Pigman wrote:NRL Rep games kill it in the ratings.
However AFL and NRL round games basically are a wash in terms of ratings overall, much of the same... except the AFL have significant viewers in all the majors, the NRL does not.The AFL has teams all over the country, the NRL does not.
So the ratings are the same, except potential advertisers buy in AFL time slots get to advertise to people across the entire country, where as those buying spaces in NRL time slots, are advertising almost exclusively to NSW and QLD

I mean i dont think you need to have a business degree to figure out that most national companies like Harvey Norman or Woolworths, or Comm Bank (and that's who's advertising in these slots, it's not Uncy Steve's Metal Detector Emporium at Fyshwick) would rather pay for ads that are seen by 1 million people across the country, than they would to have 1 million see it across only 2 states.

So again, why are we shocked they are getting more for their rights than we are?

If we want more money for our rights, we'd better figure out a way to get Perth and Adalaide in our national competition.


I don't think companies get excited about max 100k total ratings for primetime slots in the two states which generate over 50% of consumer spending. If they advertise with the NRL they get close to a million in those states and often more nationally when you factor in regional figures. I doubt the AFL get more when you look at what is been spent per ad.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:00 pm
What the figures actually show us is that the AFL TV average audience per match is 440,000 and NRL is 425,000 so far this season. This is with NRL only having three matches on FTA, whereas AFL has ALL matches on FTA in one market or other (so they maximise each, including into small markets). This is a negligible difference, and why putting just one more NRL match on FTA could easily see that difference reversed. Either way it is probably negligible.

What the figures also show us is the the TV audience is NOT national in character, it is highly concentrated geographically. Advertisers get big audiences for both sports, but they do not get national cover.

So all of the theories from The Usual Suspects are wrong.

http://www.footyindustry.com/?p=1610
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:04 pm
Pigman wrote:The people care SOOO little about the AFL, that their lowest crowd attendance average, the GC Suns is 18,000.
Which is good for what? 3rd or 4th place in the NRL

And nearly double that of the GC Titooons, their NRL counterpart

Interesting you posted those GE, given that this figure in particularly is DAMNING for the NRL v AFL debate... basically it's SOO and the Test match the rates out of it's ****, and the round games are dominated by AFL. So for 4 games a year, the NRL has huge viewership, and for the other 300 games a year, the numbers much the same, only AFL has viewers in all the majors for each game. Whilst the NRL does not.
:lol:
http://footyindustry.com/files/codewar/ ... 082015.png


I'm pointing people to the data, openly, I don't pretend things are different to what the data shows. I'm quite happy for people to have the figures. I'm the only one who's been basing arguments on the numbers from the start.
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:09 pm
What are the Brisbane Lions and Sydney Swans average crowds this year??
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:22 pm
greeneyed wrote:What the figures actually show us is that the AFL TV average audience per match is 440,000 and NRL is 425,000 so far this season. This is with NRL only having three matches on FTA, whereas AFL has ALL matches on FTA in one market or other (so they maximise each, including into small markets). This is a negligible difference, and why putting just one more NRL match on FTA could easily see that difference reversed. Either way it is probably negligible.

What the figures also show us is the the TV audience is NOT national in character, it is highly concentrated geographically. Advertisers get big audiences for both sports, but they do not get national cover.

So all of the theories from The Usual Suspects are wrong.

http://www.footyindustry.com/?p=1610


You're actually wrong.. Fox footy have exclusive rights to 5 games not shown on 7

Regional teams (swans, GWS, lions etc get a feed from fox footy via 7 mate)

http://m.afl.com.au/tv-radio/broadcast-information
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:27 pm
^ classic strawman by the usual suspects
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Ricky Stuart
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:28 pm
The problem with NRL is the market is seen as saturated and almost exclusively male. It has almost no room to increase advertising revenue.

Whatever you might think of Murdoch him moving his resources from NRL to AFL is going to massively effect the games coverage.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:30 pm
Lenny Leonard wrote:
greeneyed wrote:What the figures actually show us is that the AFL TV average audience per match is 440,000 and NRL is 425,000 so far this season. This is with NRL only having three matches on FTA, whereas AFL has ALL matches on FTA in one market or other (so they maximise each, including into small markets). This is a negligible difference, and why putting just one more NRL match on FTA could easily see that difference reversed. Either way it is probably negligible.

What the figures also show us is the the TV audience is NOT national in character, it is highly concentrated geographically. Advertisers get big audiences for both sports, but they do not get national cover.

So all of the theories from The Usual Suspects are wrong.

http://www.footyindustry.com/?p=1610


You're actually wrong.. Fox footy have exclusive rights to 5 games not shown on 7

Regional teams (swans, GWS, lions etc get a feed from fox footy via 7 mate)

http://m.afl.com.au/tv-radio/broadcast-information


You just have to look at the table, to see there's a FTA audience in one city or more for each AFL game. 7Mate is a FTA station.
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:39 pm
You're arguing against the afl website.. Oh dear
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:44 pm
Lenny Leonard wrote:You're arguing against the afl website.. Oh dear


Are they being shown on FTA TV? Generating a FTA TV audience?

This takes the cake as the worst straw man of the thread so far. And that's saying something.
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:46 pm
No they aren't.. Not all games are being shown on FTA TV in every market this weekend
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:53 pm
sorry to join late and rain on your parade GE re TV ratings and number of viewers, but here are the official ratings for the top 20 shows in 2014 across the 5 capital cities.

TOP TV EVENTS 2014 (FIVE CAPITALS)
1 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: SYDNEY V HAWTHORN (SEVEN) 2,828,000
2 MY KITCHEN RULES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (SEVEN) 2,712,000
3 THE BLOCK GLASSHOUSE — WINNER ANNOUNCED (NINE) 2,687,000
4 RUGBY LEAGUE GRAND FINAL (NINE) 2,621,000
5 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE NSW V QLD 2ND — MATCH (NINE) 2,600,000
6 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: PRESENTATIONS (SEVEN) 2,565,000
7 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE QLD V NSW 1ST — MATCH (NINE) 2,530,000
8 MY KITCHEN RULES — GRAND FINAL (SEVEN) 2,408,000
9 THE BLOCK GLASSHOUSE — AUCTION (NINE) 2,379,000
10 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES — AUCTIONS (NINE) 2,271,000

11 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (NINE) 2,265,000
12 INXS: NEVER TEAR US APART — PART 1 (SEVEN) 2,243,000
13 THE VOICE — LAUNCH (NINE) 2,229,000
14 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: ON THE GROUND (SEVEN) 2,188,000
15 MELBOURNE CUP — THE RACE (SEVEN) 2,178,000
16 INXS: NEVER TEAR US APART — PART 2 (SEVEN) 2,081,000
17 HOUSE RULES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (SEVEN) 2,070,000
18 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE QLD V NSW 3RD — MATCH (NINE) 2,057,000
19 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES -GRAND FINAL (NINE) 1,999,000
20 THE VOICE — WEDNESDAY — (NINE) 1,979,000
To all the people with telekinetic powers...please raise my hand.
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:54 pm
greeneyed wrote:
Pigman wrote:The people care SOOO little about the AFL, that their lowest crowd attendance average, the GC Suns is 18,000.
Which is good for what? 3rd or 4th place in the NRL

And nearly double that of the GC Titooons, their NRL counterpart

Interesting you posted those GE, given that this figure in particularly is DAMNING for the NRL v AFL debate... basically it's SOO and the Test match the rates out of it's ****, and the round games are dominated by AFL. So for 4 games a year, the NRL has huge viewership, and for the other 300 games a year, the numbers much the same, only AFL has viewers in all the majors for each game. Whilst the NRL does not.
:lol:
http://footyindustry.com/files/codewar/ ... 082015.png


I'm pointing people to the data, openly, I don't pretend things are different to what the data shows. I'm quite happy for people to have the figures. I'm the only one who's been basing arguments on the numbers from the start.


The data you have provided has in fact proven our point. AFL is more popular and has a true national following, RL does not.
as per date YOU supplied!

http://footyindustry.com/files/codewar/ ... 082015.png


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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:55 pm
Welcome to the straw man (realist) club rob.. You'll fit in well here
Last edited by -TW- on August 26, 2015, 12:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:55 pm
robtheraider wrote:sorry to join late and rain on your parade GE re TV ratings and number of viewers, but here are the official ratings for the top 20 shows in 2014 across the 5 capital cities.

TOP TV EVENTS 2014 (FIVE CAPITALS)
1 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: SYDNEY V HAWTHORN (SEVEN) 2,828,000
2 MY KITCHEN RULES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (SEVEN) 2,712,000
3 THE BLOCK GLASSHOUSE — WINNER ANNOUNCED (NINE) 2,687,000
4 RUGBY LEAGUE GRAND FINAL (NINE) 2,621,000
5 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE NSW V QLD 2ND — MATCH (NINE) 2,600,000
6 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: PRESENTATIONS (SEVEN) 2,565,000
7 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE QLD V NSW 1ST — MATCH (NINE) 2,530,000
8 MY KITCHEN RULES — GRAND FINAL (SEVEN) 2,408,000
9 THE BLOCK GLASSHOUSE — AUCTION (NINE) 2,379,000
10 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES — AUCTIONS (NINE) 2,271,000

11 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (NINE) 2,265,000
12 INXS: NEVER TEAR US APART — PART 1 (SEVEN) 2,243,000
13 THE VOICE — LAUNCH (NINE) 2,229,000
14 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: ON THE GROUND (SEVEN) 2,188,000
15 MELBOURNE CUP — THE RACE (SEVEN) 2,178,000
16 INXS: NEVER TEAR US APART — PART 2 (SEVEN) 2,081,000
17 HOUSE RULES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (SEVEN) 2,070,000
18 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE QLD V NSW 3RD — MATCH (NINE) 2,057,000
19 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES -GRAND FINAL (NINE) 1,999,000
20 THE VOICE — WEDNESDAY — (NINE) 1,979,000


You've not rained on my parade at all. The figures I've linked everyone to is more comprehensive than those figures.
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:56 pm
And they're wrong..
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:57 pm
Pigman wrote:
greeneyed wrote:
Pigman wrote:The people care SOOO little about the AFL, that their lowest crowd attendance average, the GC Suns is 18,000.
Which is good for what? 3rd or 4th place in the NRL

And nearly double that of the GC Titooons, their NRL counterpart

Interesting you posted those GE, given that this figure in particularly is DAMNING for the NRL v AFL debate... basically it's SOO and the Test match the rates out of it's ****, and the round games are dominated by AFL. So for 4 games a year, the NRL has huge viewership, and for the other 300 games a year, the numbers much the same, only AFL has viewers in all the majors for each game. Whilst the NRL does not.
:lol:
http://footyindustry.com/files/codewar/ ... 082015.png


I'm pointing people to the data, openly, I don't pretend things are different to what the data shows. I'm quite happy for people to have the figures. I'm the only one who's been basing arguments on the numbers from the start.


The data you have provided has in fact proven our point. AFL is more popular and has a true national following, RL does not.
as per date YOU supplied!

http://footyindustry.com/files/codewar/ ... 082015.png


JACK REEDS FOOT IS OUT! :lol:


Right, down to ridicule and pretending figures do not say what they say. I don't really understand why you're so keen to see our sport undersold to the TV networks. All the data I've provided shows there's no reason for it.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 12:59 pm
Lenny Leonard wrote:And they're wrong..


How are they wrong? They're supplied by an AFL supporter who runs that site. They're official data. You were the bloke making up figures last night.
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:00 pm
No, all the data you've provided shows there is very real, and obvious reasons why we don't get the deal the AFL get.
This is business, you pay for what you get.

The NRL's job is to grow the game and put it into the markets it isnt tapping into, in order to get that money.
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Laurie Daley
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:00 pm
robtheraider wrote:sorry to join late and rain on your parade GE re TV ratings and number of viewers, but here are the official ratings for the top 20 shows in 2014 across the 5 capital cities.

TOP TV EVENTS 2014 (FIVE CAPITALS)
1 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: SYDNEY V HAWTHORN (SEVEN) 2,828,000
2 MY KITCHEN RULES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (SEVEN) 2,712,000
3 THE BLOCK GLASSHOUSE — WINNER ANNOUNCED (NINE) 2,687,000
4 RUGBY LEAGUE GRAND FINAL (NINE) 2,621,000
5 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE NSW V QLD 2ND — MATCH (NINE) 2,600,000
6 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: PRESENTATIONS (SEVEN) 2,565,000
7 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE QLD V NSW 1ST — MATCH (NINE) 2,530,000
8 MY KITCHEN RULES — GRAND FINAL (SEVEN) 2,408,000
9 THE BLOCK GLASSHOUSE — AUCTION (NINE) 2,379,000
10 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES — AUCTIONS (NINE) 2,271,000

11 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (NINE) 2,265,000
12 INXS: NEVER TEAR US APART — PART 1 (SEVEN) 2,243,000
13 THE VOICE — LAUNCH (NINE) 2,229,000
14 SEVEN’S AFL: GRAND FINAL: ON THE GROUND (SEVEN) 2,188,000
15 MELBOURNE CUP — THE RACE (SEVEN) 2,178,000
16 INXS: NEVER TEAR US APART — PART 2 (SEVEN) 2,081,000
17 HOUSE RULES — WINNER ANNOUNCED (SEVEN) 2,070,000
18 STATE OF ORIGIN RUGBY LEAGUE QLD V NSW 3RD — MATCH (NINE) 2,057,000
19 THE BLOCK: FANS V FAVES -GRAND FINAL (NINE) 1,999,000
20 THE VOICE — WEDNESDAY — (NINE) 1,979,000


The NRL has the top 4 rating programs nationally.

Last deal the AFL got 475 million for 4 live FTA games that go for 3 hrs, and the NRL got 450m for 3 games that go for 2hrs. So how does that reflect the AFL been a more valuable FTA product?
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:03 pm
This is fantastic stuff!
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:03 pm
greeneyed wrote:
Lenny Leonard wrote:And they're wrong..


How are they wrong? They're supplied by an AFL supporter who runs that site. They're official data. You were the bloke making up figures last night.


How's that made up data...

The NRL has teams in 3/8 states and territories

The afl has them in 6/8

Do the **** maths..
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:05 pm
Lenny Leonard wrote:No they aren't.. Not all games are being shown on FTA TV in every market this weekend


Sure, some weeks a couple won't be on FTA, other weeks all. The point is that AFL has many more matches on FTA each week in at least one relevant market, than NRL. What's the import of that? Much bigger potential TV audience reach, as STV is only in 30 per cent of households.
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:07 pm
You're wrong... There is not one week of the season where all 9 games will be broadcast live on FTA..
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Laurie Daley
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:14 pm
Pigman wrote:No, all the data you've provided shows there is very real, and obvious reasons why we don't get the deal the AFL get.
This is business, you pay for what you get.

The NRL's job is to grow the game and put it into the markets it isnt tapping into, in order to get that money.


Except we did basically get the deal the AFL got last time.
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:17 pm
edwahu wrote:
Pigman wrote:No, all the data you've provided shows there is very real, and obvious reasons why we don't get the deal the AFL get.
This is business, you pay for what you get.

The NRL's job is to grow the game and put it into the markets it isnt tapping into, in order to get that money.


Except we did basically get the deal the AFL got last time.


Similar money but the AFL got far greater control of their game, and better exposure

I mean it's a bit disingenuous to say we got the same deal just on money alone. They got paid the same for giving less
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 1:17 pm
Lenny Leonard wrote:
greeneyed wrote:
Lenny Leonard wrote:And they're wrong..


How are they wrong? They're supplied by an AFL supporter who runs that site. They're official data. You were the bloke making up figures last night.


How's that made up data...

The NRL has teams in 3/8 states and territories

The afl has them in 6/8

Do the **** maths..


That's laughable!
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PostPosted: August 26, 2015, 4:12 pm
Isn't the Usual Suspects a movie?
Gina Riley: Oh, come on, John. That’s a bit old hat, the corrupt IOC delegate.
John Clarke: Old hat? Gina, in the scientific world when they see that something is happening again and again and again, repeatedly, they don’t call it old hat. They call it a pattern.
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