2017 in review - Jack Wighton

 
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Mal Meninga
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PostPosted: October 10, 2017, 8:54 pm
gangrenous wrote:1. I am unconvinced Wighton is a better left centre than Croker.
...


Good statement
There is no way Wighton is a better centre than Croker
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Gary Belcher
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 5:50 am
That is a better suggestion Pat. I wouldn't be doing it at this stage though.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 7:45 am
Raiders_Pat wrote:There is one more option which I completely forgot about, and that's Jack to 6 and letting Austin go. I used to hate this idea, but I've grown more fond of it. Another unpopular suggestion due to the fact that he was a bit of a failure there in his first stint, but he has improved substantially in setting up his men. He's a lot more of a playmaker now than he was then. If he played a genuine second fiddle role, he could be solid there for us. He did have to partner a busted Campo the first time round... Would be much better alongside a half who can take the reigns. Less positional nuances to worry about and he's proved in the past that he's good defending in the line.

I would say this is definitely a better option than the Croker suggestion, but I don't know if Ricky will want to give it another shot... The end goal is to have him playing in a position where he can add value to the team and not wasting the little room we have to move cap wise. I also don't think we'd lose anything at all switching out Austin for Wighton in the 6 jersey.


I don't hate this. In fact, its a far more constructive suggestion than most.

His tackling is certainly better than Austin, that hopefully that would be an improvement.
His ball playing has also improved since partnering the 1 legged man, esp on the sweep play.
Haven't seen too much kicking, but not really a FBs role. However, Hodgo would become your #2 kicker.

He would likely want to play on the left. He has had more attacking success down that side - please refer to the try highlights of Croker and Cotric, coz he usually has a hand in it.

Hell... I know it was floated a few years ago, but could you swap Austin and Wighton? Austin's strength is support play, and broken play running, which is FB 101. Both maintain spine status, both still get plenty of ball, but perhaps you get the best of both's strengths?
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 7:49 am
Jack to 6 instead of Austin?

Jack was ABYSMAL at 6.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 7:51 am
dubby wrote:Jack to 6 instead of Austin?

Jack was ABYSMAL at 6.


Yes he was. But look at the circumstances, and the team he was in.
He is a better player now than he was then. I'm not saying it will work, just that it might get the best from those 2 players by putting them in positions to use their strengths.
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Peter Jackson
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 8:30 am
@dubby Jack WAS (keyword) abysmal at 6... He's not the same player he was when he gave 6 a crack though. And as previously mentioned, he was also playing alongside a half who was making 7m a game and telegraphing every pass. The question we need to ask ourselves is how much do we lose by moving Wighton to Austin's spot? And the way Austin has been playing, we would probably gain more than we would lose.

@Matt I don't mind the idea of swapping them either, but I have little confidence left in Austin. He needs to show that he has more than one facet to his game or he's gotta go. Even if Wighton stays in fullback, I still think our best option to start next season would be 14. Austin until he finds form. And if he doesn't, then encourage him to look elsewhere.
Last edited by Raiders_Pat on October 11, 2017, 8:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 8:31 am
It's all moot anyway.

He'll be fullback next year.
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Peter Jackson
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 8:35 am
dubby wrote:It's all moot anyway.

He'll be fullback next year.

All signs do point to him being our fullback next year. But from memory, Ricky did mention when he ended the Wighton to 6 experiment that he sees Jack as a 6 long term. It's a slim possibility, not a completely unlikely scenario though.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 8:41 am
Raiders_Pat wrote:
dubby wrote:It's all moot anyway.

He'll be fullback next year.

All signs do point to him being our fullback next year. But from memory, Ricky did mention when he ended the Wighton to 6 experiment that he sees Jack as a 6 long term. It's a slim possibility, not a completely unlikely scenario though.


I think jack will be in the #1 too, but its a thought.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 8:42 am
Rick said that to save face that Jack at 6 was not successful.
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Steve Walters
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 8:57 am
I can't see Jack at 6 working much better than it did the first tine. IMO he belongs in positions where less on the spot thinking is required. So probably centre with the 2nd row as an alternative long term plan - his handling would need to improve though.

Of course we don't have a vacant centre spot.

And as said he will be fullback as long as Stuart is here.
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Peter Jackson
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 9:07 am
We can speculate all we like on why Rick said something in the media, but we will never know what Ricky's true thoughts on that are. What we do know is that we have the 2017 rookie of the year and 2016 Australian Schoolboys fullback playing on the wing. And it's not going to last. He will get picked up by another club who can either offer him more money or a shot at FB/centre on his next contract. It's a waste to have somebody who could potentially be our best fullback since Schifcofske on the wing, particularly while our current fullback is showing that he lacks the qualities that would allow him to elevate to the level of a class fullback.

I know that things likely won't change there, but I also think that is even more of a moot point. We're on a supporters forum here, opinions and speculation is what goes down in forums like this. There is also every chance that a player might get injured or Stuart gets the sack, and a positional change I was advocating for happens following that... best believe I will be telling all you naysayers "I told you so" when that happens :roflmao
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 9:21 am
Raiders_Pat wrote:We can speculate all we like on why Rick said something in the media, but we will never know what Ricky's true thoughts on that are. What we do know is that we have the 2017 rookie of the year and 2016 Australian Schoolboys fullback playing on the wing. And it's not going to last. He will get picked up by another club who can either offer him more money or a shot at FB/centre on his next contract. It's a waste to have somebody who could potentially be our best fullback since Schifcofske on the wing, particularly while our current fullback is showing that he lacks the qualities that would allow him to elevate to the level of a class fullback.

I know that things likely won't change there, but I also think that is even more of a moot point. We're on a supporters forum here, opinions and speculation is what goes down in forums like this. There is also every chance that a player might get injured or Stuart gets the sack, and a positional change I was advocating for happens following that... best believe I will be telling all you naysayers "I told you so" when that happens :roflmao


Cotric has a loooooooooooooooooooooooooong way to go to be an NRL fullback. In fact, despite his junior footy, I'm pretty confident he will not make the cut in the position. FB is no longer a souly ball running position. It is now another 5/8 type role. All the footy I've seem from him has been based off a 'power game', with offload. Perfect for a winger, centre or backrower, however, its not suited to FB, not anymore. With his body type etc, I can totally see him have a career path that matches a Jason Croker, Reuben Wiki (maybe not all the way to prop), or Luke Lewis. As is, come into grade on a wing, and slowly progress in field.

The next thing I will say is, what's wrong with being a top draw winger? They still get paid. Rapana, Mansause, Vunivalu, Addo-Carr, Nofo and Semi (didn't like not being paid, and TBF, I don't blame him) all seem happy being amongst the best in their selected position.

Anyway, I think he will do his 'apprenticeship' on the wing, then take over from Croker or, more likely, BJ in a few yrs time.
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Peter Jackson
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 9:55 am
Yeah I do see him as more of a centre too. But it's not like he's had much of a chance to show any ball playing ability either... He has been playing on the wing. There is nothing wrong with being a top shelf winger (aside from the fact that your maximum earning potential is significantly lower than the majority of starting spots), but the guys you mentioned have also pretty much always been wingers primarily throughout their career... they won't be upset about playing there nor thinking they would be better utilised in another position.

If a player is stuck on the wing, and he wants to/has the skills to play fullback or centre, it's very easy for a rival club to say "you will have a proper crack at FB/centre here", offer him basically the same money and poach him. We need to have a solid plan in place for him which will allow him to feel comfortable that he has a path for progression here at the Raiders. Also, the fact that Cotric is more suited to centre makes me even more of the belief that we're carrying too many NRL quality centres in our squad, which would be hampering our ability to recruit in other positions of need. We need to sort out our **** in some way or another.
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Don Furner
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 10:01 am
Raiders_Pat wrote:Yeah I do see him as more of a centre too. But it's not like he's had much of a chance to show any ball playing ability either... He has been playing on the wing. There is nothing wrong with being a top shelf winger (aside from the fact that your maximum earning potential is significantly lower than the majority of starting spots), but the guys you mentioned have also pretty much always been wingers primarily throughout their career... they won't be upset about playing there nor thinking they would be better utilised in another position.

If a player is stuck on the wing, and he wants to/has the skills to play fullback or centre, it's very easy for a rival club to say "you will have a proper crack at FB/centre here", offer him basically the same money and poach him. We need to have a solid plan in place for him which will allow him to feel comfortable that he has a path for progression here at the Raiders. Also, the fact that Cotric is more suited to centre makes me even more of the belief that we're carrying too many NRL quality centres in our squad, which would be hampering our ability to recruit in other positions of need. We need to sort out our **** in some way or another.


While that's true, I don't anyone will see him as a FB, because of the modern role of a FB. If anyone poaches him, it will be because there is a centre spot up for grabs - however, at the end of his contract, we will have 1 to fill in BJ anyway.

As for ball playing, he didn't do that much as a jr either, so he isn't going to suddenly be able to now, playing on a wing or not.
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Ruben Wiki
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 6:45 pm
Pigman wrote:
gangrenous wrote:1. I am unconvinced Wighton is a better left centre than Croker.
...


Good statement
There is no way Wighton is a better centre than Croker


Lol. Wut?

He's faster than Croker
He's stronger than Croker
He's a better defender than Croker
He can set up his outside man better than Croker

Reality is the complete opposite of your statement is true.
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Ruben Wiki
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 7:11 pm
afgtnk wrote:
Pigman wrote:
gangrenous wrote:1. I am unconvinced Wighton is a better left centre than Croker.
...


Good statement
There is no way Wighton is a better centre than Croker


Lol. Wut?

He's faster than Croker
He's stronger than Croker
He's a better defender than Croker
He can set up his outside man better than Croker

Reality is the complete opposite of your statement is true.

His feet certainly arent faster then croker, maybe over 100m but I dont think over 10m he is.
He is stronger then croker
He is about an equal defender to croker.
and does he set up his outside man better then croker?
he is also far far EDIT then croker.
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Laurie Daley
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PostPosted: October 11, 2017, 9:26 pm
Wighton to centre please. We’d stiffen up our defensive line having Wigton there, it would help support our weak defensive halves. And he has no issues putting his winger away. We haven’t seen the best of Wighton, and only will when he moves into his natural position, which is centre.

Croker’s not doing enough to have a mortgage down on that position.
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Alan Tongue
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PostPosted: October 12, 2017, 11:36 pm
Taking away all the positives about him being respected leader by the playing group and such a positive influence off the field (including commemrciallly etc for the club).

The reality is that Croker is a quality NRL standard 1st grade Center - that is all.

He has had 1 season in 9 where he could be considered elite and without knowing his wage is probably on considerable overs for what his on field output actually is. Successfully clubs probably wouldn't hesitate to move him on or a positional change in order to improve.

I'd be happy to see Wighton given a chance at Center over him, he has shown enough in his career with his skill set to show he could potentially excel in the position - maybe it wouldn't work out but Croker certainly hasn't done anything (outside 2016) to have a mortgage on the position. A successful club would prob make the move
Last edited by scotchberry on October 13, 2017, 9:13 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Laurie Daley
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PostPosted: October 13, 2017, 6:30 am
This is all moot.

Jack will wear No.1 in the trials and all through the 24rnds.

That's right....
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